Comments on: Do we have the ideal idealism? http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/ Web Design, Wordpress Theme Design, Bandung, Indonesia Mon, 01 Feb 2010 03:13:16 +0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Nick http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-8922 Nick Mon, 12 Jan 2009 22:03:47 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-8922 It is interesting that people dwell on 'ideals' at all. I think most if not all people have an ideology, some are pure doctrine handed down or picked up along the way others have more nuanced ideologies. It makes me wonder that if perhaps having an "ideal" self or environment is an innate component of human thought. If human beings fundamentally seek to free themselves from oppressive conditions (and I'm not just referring to political conditions; physical, mental, and social as well) then perhaps having an "ideal" any "ideal" is a way to orient a person in the direction that is free of conditions of oppression. If this is the case then any "ideal" is ideal if it performs a liberating function for the person who holds it. This notion throws sand on the notion of a universally ideal "ideal" but I think it is probably closer to the truth. Whatever that is. It is interesting that people dwell on ‘ideals’ at all. I think most if not all people have an ideology, some are pure doctrine handed down or picked up along the way others have more nuanced ideologies. It makes me wonder that if perhaps having an “ideal” self or environment is an innate component of human thought. If human beings fundamentally seek to free themselves from oppressive conditions (and I’m not just referring to political conditions; physical, mental, and social as well) then perhaps having an “ideal” any “ideal” is a way to orient a person in the direction that is free of conditions of oppression. If this is the case then any “ideal” is ideal if it performs a liberating function for the person who holds it. This notion throws sand on the notion of a universally ideal “ideal” but I think it is probably closer to the truth. Whatever that is.

]]> By: Andrew Slominski http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7429 Andrew Slominski Sat, 06 Dec 2008 01:52:05 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7429 Murry N. Rothbard has an excellent essay called "Egalitarianism as a Revolt Against Nature". It's very thought provoking for anyone that's questioning the whole ideology vs. reality argument. In summary, if the ideal is at odds with nature (Biology or Physics, etc.) then the ideal is inherently bad and anti-human. If nature says we're all different down to the most minute detail, then its anti-human to say we all could be, or should be, equal in all ways. Equal in the eyes of God and under the Law, sure, but in all ways, no. Oh by the way, I'm using a modified version of your free theme, although I may upgrade some day soon. Thanks I love it! Murry N. Rothbard has an excellent essay called “Egalitarianism as a Revolt Against Nature”. It’s very thought provoking for anyone that’s questioning the whole ideology vs. reality argument. In summary, if the ideal is at odds with nature (Biology or Physics, etc.) then the ideal is inherently bad and anti-human. If nature says we’re all different down to the most minute detail, then its anti-human to say we all could be, or should be, equal in all ways. Equal in the eyes of God and under the Law, sure, but in all ways, no.

Oh by the way, I’m using a modified version of your free theme, although I may upgrade some day soon. Thanks I love it!

]]> By: Leonardus Angga http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7314 Leonardus Angga Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:10:56 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7314 Yeah, I’ve seen that there’s a lot of idealist in HIMATEK ^^ Really, A LOT. :P Yeah, I’ve seen that there’s a lot of idealist in HIMATEK ^^

Really, A LOT. :P

]]> By: yonna http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7313 yonna Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:10:08 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7313 ya ampun, kenapa sih saban kali gue mau nulis terminology pasti ujungnya termination? hahahaha…gak teliti :mrgreen: ya bener, dua2nya berlawanan, tapi menurut gue bukan berarti salah satunya lbh buruk/lbh baik daripada lainnya, so that’s why i try to mix it altogether. lagian saya bukan tipe ekstrim kanan kiri atas bawah depan belakang dll, makanya gitu deh maen campur aja kaya makan baso aja hehe :mrgreen: ya ampun, kenapa sih saban kali gue mau nulis terminology pasti ujungnya termination? hahahaha…gak teliti :mrgreen:

ya bener, dua2nya berlawanan, tapi menurut gue bukan berarti salah satunya lbh buruk/lbh baik daripada lainnya, so that’s why i try to mix it altogether. lagian saya bukan tipe ekstrim kanan kiri atas bawah depan belakang dll, makanya gitu deh maen campur aja kaya makan baso aja hehe :mrgreen:

]]> By: Michael http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7312 Michael Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:07:57 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7312 You have a point there. And it’s kinda reinforcing the idea that ideal idealism does not exist, just like I believe it doesn’t. You said that if I started to think that my idealism is bothering me, it might be a sign that that is not the right one for me. Well, that’s easy. Here’s the thing: What if we found somebody who is totally idealist but he did not realize that, in others’ point of view, he was acting a bit absurd rather than being a true idealist? But then, if we take a look at the definition of what idealism is, we will end up in total confusion because there is no such thing like ideal idealism, no parameters on how far idealism may have gone wrong. (wrong? can I say “wrong”?) hehehe.. :D examples: - being nationalists/religious or spreading compulsive hatreds - being green or just blinded (or stupid). - acting against government corruption conducts or just being “sok-tau” A: “Hey, man! You’re spreading hatreds!” B: “No, I wasn’t. I was just showing my pride to my nation/religion.” Duh. :twisted: :twisted: You have a point there. And it’s kinda reinforcing the idea that ideal idealism does not exist, just like I believe it doesn’t. You said that if I started to think that my idealism is bothering me, it might be a sign that that is not the right one for me. Well, that’s easy.

Here’s the thing:
What if we found somebody who is totally idealist but he did not realize that, in others’ point of view, he was acting a bit absurd rather than being a true idealist? But then, if we take a look at the definition of what idealism is, we will end up in total confusion because there is no such thing like ideal idealism, no parameters on how far idealism may have gone wrong. (wrong? can I say “wrong”?) hehehe.. :D

examples:
- being nationalists/religious or spreading compulsive hatreds
- being green or just blinded (or stupid).
- acting against government corruption conducts or just being “sok-tau”

A: “Hey, man! You’re spreading hatreds!”
B: “No, I wasn’t. I was just showing my pride to my nation/religion.”

Duh. :twisted: :twisted:

]]> By: Michael http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7311 Michael Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:07:17 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7311 Wow, that’s interesting. It’s quite logical, indeed. I just can’t imagine if our beloved country, Indonesia, had already been 450 years old, things would have been a lot different. Perhaps, we all would have a clearer meaning on how nationalism/patriotism should be like. Wow, that’s interesting. It’s quite logical, indeed. I just can’t imagine if our beloved country, Indonesia, had already been 450 years old, things would have been a lot different. Perhaps, we all would have a clearer meaning on how nationalism/patriotism should be like.

]]> By: Michael http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7310 Michael Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:07:07 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7310 Well, I don’t see it as “boxes” by the way. Actually, I was trying to distinguish which is right and wrong but just can’t seem to find a solution because right and wrong themselves are perceptively a vague idea. I also don’t see it as a defining matters to our identity because the concept is basically undefinable. Hahahaha.. damn. Anyway, thanks for the comment. It actually opened another perspective on this matter. Well, I don’t see it as “boxes” by the way. Actually, I was trying to distinguish which is right and wrong but just can’t seem to find a solution because right and wrong themselves are perceptively a vague idea. I also don’t see it as a defining matters to our identity because the concept is basically undefinable. Hahahaha.. damn. Anyway, thanks for the comment. It actually opened another perspective on this matter.

]]> By: Michael http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7309 Michael Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:06:55 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7309 Yup, it’s truly dubious. Anyway, I didn’t get it clearly when you compared idealism to the “sun” fact. Were you saying that idealism that exists among us are something ambivalent? And, can you explain the progressive idealism that you have? Sounds like music to me. Hehe.. :mrgreen: Yup, it’s truly dubious. Anyway, I didn’t get it clearly when you compared idealism to the “sun” fact. Were you saying that idealism that exists among us are something ambivalent? And, can you explain the progressive idealism that you have? Sounds like music to me. Hehe.. :mrgreen:

]]> By: Michael http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7308 Michael Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:06:38 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7308 Wheew, what a comprehensive explanation you have there. And Yonna, the term “realistic idealist” is a bit tickling me. As in fact, based on the dictionary, “idealist” is the antonym of “realist”. Pulling the two words together would mean having some kind of balance, aye? Hehe.. Kuliahan ya gitu deh.. nunggu ujian komprehensif.. skripsi kebetulan sudah beres. hehehe.. Wheew, what a comprehensive explanation you have there. And Yonna, the term “realistic idealist” is a bit tickling me. As in fact, based on the dictionary, “idealist” is the antonym of “realist”. Pulling the two words together would mean having some kind of balance, aye? Hehe..

Kuliahan ya gitu deh.. nunggu ujian komprehensif.. skripsi kebetulan sudah beres. hehehe..

]]> By: Michael http://michaelhutagalung.com/2008/10/do-we-have-the-ideal-idealism/comment-page-1/#comment-7307 Michael Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:04:09 +0000 http://michaelhutagalung.com/?p=816#comment-7307 LOL. You have nice idea there. Why don’t try it all? I’m still in my 20s now. Hehehe. LOL. You have nice idea there. Why don’t try it all? I’m still in my 20s now. Hehehe.

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